並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/tw/podcast/ep-25-%E8%B7%9F%E8%91%97%E7%9B%B4%E8%A6%BA%E4%BE%86-%E6%AC%BE%E5%BE%85%E8%87%AA%E5%B7%B1-feat-%E6%BD%98%E8%96%87%E5%AE%89-penny-%E5%9F%BA%E9%9A%86-%E6%B5%B7%E9%82%A3%E9%82%8A-%E6%9C%80%E7%BE%8E%E9%97%86%E5%A8%98/id1558911157?i=1000543504958