並前往https://www.listennotes.com/podcasts/%E5%B0%8F%E5%B0%8F%E6%9E%97%E5%9C%8D%E6%A3%8B-%E5%B0%8F%E5%B0%8F%E6%9E%97%E5%9C%8D%E6%A3%8B-4uFOTLtXPZh/